LOL and you never hear of a Catholic school being attacked, at least not physically.

I am all for the armed security, and I honestly think it should be a police officer. The newer schools are already built like prisons, so access to the students is already limited. We're not talking about hallway patrols, just an armed presence on the property. The value added to having a police officer present can add to deterrence to other crimes on school property such as drug use and gang presence. Many schools would benefit in multiple ways, especially the inner city schools where crime and violence is a daily issue for those students.

An officer present at school is a deterrence to all but the most professional gun users. The school will now no longer be a target range that these unstable sorts know have no protection afforded to the children they are tasked with taking care of each day. We haven't had professional 'hit man' attack a school yet, and I doubt we will. The cost of an officer, or two, or three, depending upon the size of said school, is negligible when you look at the annual cost of your average school budget. The schools in our state could easily roll this into the annual working budget and the benefit will far out way the cost here, if protection of your children is what you are seeking.

Ceri, I have modified my view a bit on that subject. The President chose his daughters' school based on having an armed security detail on premises. This protection for his daughters is over and above the individual secret service protection provided for each.My own daughter went to high school with one of our former Governor's sons and shared several classes each day. The lad was always shadowed by a plain clothes Highway Patrol officer. As for the officer, I can't imagine what horrible thing he did in a past life to deserve being forced to attend high school twice in this life.

A friend of mine suggested schools could use retired police officers for this duty. He also pointed out that our Catholic schools in town already have armed security. They use Nuns armed with large rulers.

Not sure I agree Harold...for sure it's a mind numbing prospect BUT if we are not prepared to embrace more radical alternatives, and our history suggests that we are not, where else do we go? My only caveat is...do not expect teachers to do this!!! It cant be cops either ( as Jeff Morgan has pointed out in this thread ). If it happens it will have to be armed security guards imho.

I have inhabited parts of Cardiff where the prospect of police officers arresting themselves would occasion much mirth

I have been told that even a life sentence with "no chance of parole" cannotnecessarily be taken at face value. I will also say that I have mixed feelings about some of the highly publicized cases where convicted felons are released after DNA testing. First of all, the DNA evidence was gathered at a time when no one even knew it was evidence. Then it sat unprotected in evidence rooms devoid of modern means for preservation. The case is reopened years or decades later with many of the principals now dead including witnesses, jury members, prosecutors and/or judges and even those who remain alive, retain memories growing fainter each day. To me there is no doubt that DNA gathered and preserved properly should factor prominently in the legal proceedings. And the idea that any defendant was convicted wrongfully is unacceptable. Nevertheless, knowing the rationale and lengths some members of the defense bar are willing to go, I remain a bit skeptical.

Jeff, I cannot agree more on the subject of "truth in sentencing." It's a phrase I've used for years. A few years ago I heard of man in Kansas City being sentenced to 4 life sentences plus 1 day. I asked a friend in the court system what on earth that meant? He said something to this effect, "By adding 1 day to 4 life sentences the judge was attempting to guarantee the killer would have to stay in prison no less than 20 years. Otherwise," he said, "The killer could becomeeligiblefor parole in seven."

The killer knew what the sentence meant. His lawyers knew what it meant. The prosecutor knew what it meant. Only the general public is left wondering will he or will he not get out of prison someday and kill again. In my opinion, this lenient judicial system and its revolving door policy is the ONLY reason many people reluctantly support the death penalty. If families of the victims were 100% sure that the killer would remain absolutely,positively behind bars for the rest of his life, they would feel no need to see the murderer executed. A system that is too lenient fails everyone--including the criminal.

I actually did not realize that. Points for the NRA in this instance then.

And that's one spot where I DEFINITELY part with the NRA - if you are selling a firearm, there ought to be a background check. Even if you're passing it down to a family member, there should be a check done, and an official transfer. I don't see why, if you have to be licensed to drive a car, you shouldn't have to be licensed to carry a weapon. If that was in place and enforced, I think we'd see far fewer issues. The NRA seems to paint that concept with varying shades of paranoia, but if one has nothing to hide, why hide it? It does NOT infringe on constitutional rights, and addresses what I can't help but believe to be the real issue - the person pulling the trigger. If a person is trained, has no criminal background, and is of sound mind, I see no reason why they should not be permitted to own pretty much whatever firearm they wish to own. On the other hand, I know any number of people I wouldn't trust with a butter knife. Unfortunately, I don't think anyone is actually prosecuting background check violations. Maybe if we actually enforced the laws we already have....

Three and a half centuries before Christ, Plato provided this maxim, "Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."

The NRA (love 'em or hate 'em) has long advocated and lobbied incessantly for laws mandating the harshest of penalties against anyone who uses a gun to commit a crime. In other words, if a gun is used, loaded or unloaded, in any fashion (including simple possession) during the commission of a crime, the criminal should receive mandatory punishment many times greater than the statutory punishment for that crime. To me it's only logical. If a criminal uses a gun to steal beer and lottery tickets from a local convenience store, it means that he has determined, or premeditated, that he is willing to kill for wanton and trivial gain. Why shouldn't that criminal receive the harshest of punishment? Yet, the American Left (not to be confused, I think, with normal right/leftpoliticsin other countries) steadfastlyresists these tougher sanctions.

The Constitution was written a very long time ago and I don't think that anyone could have foreseen that there would be such a huge and diverse population and such a propensity for violence.

The answer must lie in education (both in the home and in school). As long as young people believe there is nothing better for them than belonging to gangs, there is going to be violence.

Hallo Sergeant Jeffrey Morgan

Obviously I don't have the experience of having been in an American school, which puts me at a disadvantage in this discussion. I fear that the US has simply had too many guns for too long for any laws to be truly effective but at least the President is trying. Perhaps it's a case of starting with young people, giving them alternatives to gang membership and violence; there's an experiment being carried out in London now, attempting to do just that. It must also begin in the home though, just as any kind of discipline does, through example and firmness.

I'll be interested to hear your views on the subject, especially as you work in such a high crime area and have great experience of these problems.

Gaynor

Last night at about 9.40pm, two men (or so it's thought) shot some bullets through the window of a home in the Cricklewood area of North London, hitting a woman and her daughter. Fortunately, neither was fatally hurt but everyone is at a loss to know what the motive was. As it's a residential area, there are thought to be several witnesses so we can only hope the men are found and the motive discovered.

Gaynor, That's a good observation. It's already the case that the real guns in those movie scenes have sound added later. When firing "blanks" there is flash, a small amount of smoke and a popping sound; but it sounds entirely different from the real thing. Much of the sound we hear from a real gun is essentially caused by a small "sonic boom" when by the projectile leaves the muzzle. Even a "silencer" cannotsuppressthat "boom." That's why the preferred weapon of assassins is a small caliber handgun, silencer and a very light load (much of the gun powder is removed from the cartridge). They have to keep the projectile beneath the speed of sound to effectively suppress the sound.

MA Governor just filed a similar bill here. If the legislature passes this crap I may be moving north. Knee-jerk laws are ridiculous and the people who allow their reps to pass this crap need to have their heads examined. The media and gov't have the general public whipped with their scare tactics.

Even if this latest event had happened with smaller capacity magazines, the same number of people/children would have been killed. Without an armed response, you won't stop an armed assailant. These lawmakers are nuts.

These are further examples of extreme reactions and complete lack of common sense and imagination on the part of officialdom. At least in the case of TV and film, computer technology can make it seem as though a gun has been fired so I suppose they could use replicas.

If the situation hadn't become so out of hand in the first place, none of these would be happening.

Pennsylvania girl, 5, suspended for threatening to shoot a girl with pink "Hello Kity" toy gun that blows soapy bubbles

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/01/19/pennsylvania-girl-5-suspended-for-threatening-to-shoot-girl-with-pink-toy-gun/#ixzz2IQqejizb

A school official overheard the threat at the school bus stop and immediately searched the kindergartner's backpack. The weapon was not found. Nevertheless, the next morning she was called to the office and questioned until she was in tears--then suspended from the school.

Six year old suspended from Maryland school for forming imaginary gun with his fingers while playing a game of "cops and robbers" during recess

http://www.kvue.com/news/Child-suspended-for-using-finger-as-imaginary-gun-187349051.html

I wonder...

When New York State passed the newest, strictest gun control law in the country, did it make provisions for the continued use of guns in film and television? After all, these weapons are the staple of crime fighting television shows filmed in New York City. Most of these guns are real and fire "blanks." The barrel can't be "plugged" or else the gun would explode when fired. I wonder if Hollywood was accorded special "privileges"within the new law even though it didn't even provide allowances for New York's own police officers and swat teams. I predict this oversight will eventually be called Albany's "Barney Fife" incident.

In Governor Cuomo and New York State's eagerness to be the first to impose tough new gun laws in response to the Newtown massacre they have apparently made it illegal for most of their police officers--including Swat teams to bear arms. At least, from their current arsenal.

http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news%2Flocal%2Fnew_york&a...

The public shouldn't worry because I doubt the police officers will arrest themselves. The embarrassed Governor and State Legislature have promised that they will overhaul their overhaul of State's gun laws quickly.

Meanwhile, in the interim before the flaw is corrected, one might expect a few months hence (based on the extremely litigious nature of the defense bar in that State), to hear motions in court for dismissal of evidence against helpless, "innocent" clients because armed police apprehended said clients using illegal firearms. Furthermore, I shouldn't be too surprised to hear, in some of the more "compassionate" and lenient judicial circuits, that the motions are sustained.

Good grief, fancy anyone giving Dan Brown that much credence! I can see that hat being copied by Top Shop very soon.

Lovely! There may be some market potential in these!

I wanted to whip out a lovely pagoda-ish thing but time was of the essence so we had to settle for the dealie-bobbers and skyhook on top. We upheld our defining principal, "quality content is KING!"

Agreed...I'll take the Knights!

Foil Hat by Gaabriel ( Portland Duct tape Millinery Class )

My daughter was telling me just a couple of nights ago that anacquaintanceof hers, a college professor, was grading papers and he kept seeing references and quotes in one of his student's term papers to "*Brown." When he read the bibliography at the end he saw that she based much of her paper on the "DaVinci Code." I think in addition to the Illuminati we should to look into the Free Masons and the Knights Templar.

Just where do the Illuminati fit into all this? Seems like the Iranians missed a trick there.

Yes (it was that Hagel--unfortunately for him at this point in his career) and there are those in the opposite wing who think the Newtown killer is just another Herschel Grynszpan.

Despots know that the public wants simple answers to complex problems. It's one of the certainties in life.

We say: Let's do something even if it's wrong or ineffectual. I will say this: I've yet to hear of anyone wearing a foil hat that has been subsequently abducted by aliens. So, maybe we should all just dutifully put on the foil hats (freely offered by our politicians) and make believe all is well on planet Earth.

Diolch Harold....it's all clear to me now....the Hagel connection, or is that Hegel? Certainly Hegel is referenced at one point in the article. Could this mean that there is also a sinister connection to German idealist philosophy? If so we are all in deep trouble. Where's my tin foil hat?

Ceri, this is the initial Iranian article I found blaming the massacre on Israeli death squads.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2012/12/18/278706/israeli-squads-tied-to-newtown-carnage/

Notice the .ir top-level domain extension which is assigned to Iran. The writer has acommendablecommand of the English language and quotes American sources (probably out of context).

The article also blames the massacre of the 77 school children in Norway on Israel.

Agreed....'preliminary findings' seems like a sensible idea. I must admit I haven't seen any of the conspiracy theories online. Does anyone have any links?

there's a mouthful to think on there.

Within 24 hours of the killings I read an article originating in the Middle East claiming that an Israeli Death Squad was behind the killings. According to the writer of this article thismassacrewas done to coerce Obama into increasing funding for Israel. As outlandish as it sounds I guarantee you that there are millions of radical Islamists who believe it.

But one thing bother me. Why are we told that we must wait several months for official findings? I realize there's lots of bureaucratic red-tape which must be observed, but, I should think that many of the questions surrounding this tragedy were known within hours; yet the public is told it must wait. This is always the case in airline crashes, too. It seems unwarranted. In my opinion this only invites conspiracy theories. A simple caveat introducing preliminary findings would suffice: This is what we know so far.

I do think that the public has a right to know why the school was locked down before the shootings. Had the mother, a former employee, warned the school that her son was threatening outlandish things? Whatpsychotropicdrugs were being prescribed to the perp? Some of these drugs come with warnings sayings "this drug can cause suicidal and homicidal thoughts in some patients." Was the perp taking such a drug? If so, I think the parents of other children who are being given the same drug need to know! Did compliance with the HIPPA law prevent his mental health caregivers from notifyingauthorities of potential problems? Do we need to rethink the shroud of secrecy surrounding mental illness? If mentally ill individuals and convicted felons (frequently one and the same) are barred from possessing firearms what good is it if another law prohibits disclosure of said problems? Do we need to re-examine the legal process surrounding thecommittalof an individual to a mental institution? Is it absolutely necessary to notify a suicidal or homicidal individual in writing then prolong the process with weeks or months of scheduled hearings to individuals who could potentially lose their freedom?Can there be proper safeguards for all concerned without trampling underfoot the rights of an individual?

Instead, the public is told: You must wait. That in itself seems like an invitation for conspiracy theorists to fill thevacuum.

New York State passes new gun law.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/15/us/new-york-gun-bill/index.html

Staggered to see today that there are now "conspiracy theories" doing the rounds regarding the Newtown deaths. On the one hand there's a professor who claims that coverage of the killings was unnecessarily prolonged on behalf of the anti-gun lobby; on the other hand, one person is claiming that the Obama administration had the killings carried out deliberately to boost its anti-gun plans. And I expect these people actually own guns too - that is frightening.

I've been to Kennesaw, Georgia many times. It's a very beautiful little town just north of Atlanta nestled in the pines at the foot of Mount Kennesaw. It was the site of the last stand of Confederate defenders of Atlanta as Sherman marched toward the prize. After the Battle of Kennesaw Mountain he razed Atlanta to the ground. I suspect the murder rate in Cobb county is much greater than the national average but I also suspect it is lower in Marrietta, Kennesaw and other smaller suburbs surrounding modern day City of Atlanta.

The FBI says that the murder rate for my state, Missouri, is 2.0 per 100,000. Missouri is about the size of West Germany (before reunification) and when you exclude the two largest metropolitan areas--St. Louis and Kansas City--it is actually as safe here as it is in much of Western Europe. The UK, for instance, has a murder rate of 1.2 per 100,000.

That said, the NRA's suggestion that every school should have armed guards ranks up there as one of the dumbest things I've ever heard! Even the President scoffed at it! This, in spite of the fact that the school he chose for his daughters boasted that it is safe and secure with a staff of 11 armed guards on duty at all times. In all fairness, though, I suppose if I lived in Washington D.C., Chicago, or Midsomer County in England I might want that too.

I happened to see something in passing today about a town called Kennesaw in Georgia. In 1982 it passed an ordinance that the head of every household had to hold and maintain a weapon with the appropriate ammunition. Exempt from this requirement is anyone with physical or mental disabilities which make it too difficult to do so, also convicted felons (for obvious reasons), paupers who simply can't afford it and people who have religious objections to doing so. Apparently the town has the lowest rate of violence in the county (but I don't know how violent the rest of the county is!!).

Ceri I also saw that map and could not believe how many killings we have here in the USA compared to other countries. I was astounded. Is America that much bigger then other countries. I wish I could figure this out. Just can't believe it. When you see the numbers it is a completely different story.

Speaking of guns this video was done in memory of the victims of Sandy Hook by Alex Boye'

What a voice. Very moving...........

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865569448/Alex-Boye-releases-tribute-video-for-Sandy-Hook-Elementary-shooting-victims.html?pg=all

I guess my question to that data might be: which year, what are the per capita rates, and why do we only compare ourselves to other European or European descendant countries?

I don't remember that particular X-Files episode (although I probably would if I saw it). Amazing.

Isn't it! I did a check to see if that medical condition actually exists. It's called CIP and extremely rare. I once saw an X-Files episode about it but thought it was just a fictional condition.

Gosh, I didn't realise he couldn't feel pain. That is very weird. All the more reason to keep him away from those video games and weapons.

Allegedly this young man could not feel physical pain. One of his former electronics teachers said he had to monitor the student when solderingcomponentson a motherboard because he could easily burn himself without knowing it. Supposedly his mother had decided that he should be institutionalized and had begun the legal process of gettingconservatorship over him.

I haven't watched the example to which you've given the link yet but I ask this question: WHY WAS THE LAD ALLOWED TO WATCH THESE THINGS? Why are any kids, come that? Secondly, had the guns not been available to him, it's unlikely that he would have gone out and looked for a gun; it was simply that the guns were there and easily available.

There are always going to be people (thankfully, very few) who are going to be susceptible to suggestion from films/video games/theatre/TV but the vast majority of us can watch Tarantino movies without going and cutting someone's ear off to the accompaniment of Stealer's Wheel, just as we can go and see Julius Caesar without wanting to stab someone.

The little that I've seen of video games (trailers for them on TV for example) does make them seem to be extreme but surely someone should have been monitoring the boy and what he was watching, given his known mental state.

Makers of violent video games and Hollywood itself have come under fire in the wake of the senseless massacre in Newtown.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/12/19/us-usa-shooting-connecticut-entertainmen-idUSBRE8BI1LU20121219

Reportedly the CT perpetrator was an avid "Call to Duty" gamer and spent hours upon hours in seclusion playing these games.

Here's a sample of "Call to Duty" (strong caution - viewer beware). I'm not going to embed the video because I find it too creepy but here's the link:

Obviously video games and violent movies don't kill people but can a rational person discount the claim that these very realistic simulators might spawn or nurture ideas? Every horrible crime begins with an idea.

I think it's worth consideration.

I would have printed and scanned it but it was a bit long for that. We can't retain everything in our minds - we'd probably go mad if we did! What impressed me was the fact that Australia could get itself together so quickly to pass a law like that; I realise that the US has more states but it gives one hope that something could be done.

Thanks Gaynor, I wish I could read the entire article but I understand why newspapers are doing this. Even our local newspaper has gone to a subscription service on some articles.

Also, shamefully, I admit I had completely forgotten about the Dunblane shootings--which is part of the problem, I think. Immediately after the most recent massacre in CT I was trying to remember when and how many children the Norway shooter killed. I am embarrassed to say I had to look it up. How quickly we (or at least I) forget the details.

Today, in The Times, Sir Peter Lampl (philanthropist) writes about his campaign against hand guns in Britain.

In the 1970s, he went to live in Boston and was horrified that the city had more murders in a year than the whole of Britain. In the 1990s, he moved back to Britain and feared that this country was moving in the same direction. After the shootings in Dunblane in 1996 (Thomas Hamilton shot 16 five and six-year olds and their teacher), he joined a campaign to ban handguns and, having met two of the dead children's parents, he funded the campaign. It resulted in a complete ban on the private ownership of handguns in Britain.

Six weeks after the Dunblane shootings, there was a massacre in Tasmania, claiming 35 lives and wounding 18 other people. That led to a change right across Australia - a ban on semi-automatic and pump-action shotguns. The Prime Minister, John Howard, won agreement from both state and federal governments in the space of 2 weeks. A study by Sydney University found that in the 18 years prior to the ban, there were 13 mass shootings in Australia; in the following 10 years, there were none.

Lampl states that there are some 5,000 gun shows across the USA each year, selling everything from Samurai swords and tiny handguns to semi-automatics like the one used in Newtown. US federal law requires gun-dealers to be licensed and to perform background checks but that does not apply to "occasional sales" at gun shows.

Apparently UN statistics show that there are 3.2 killings involving firearms per 100,000 people in the US, compared with 0.1 in the UK and Australia.

If you have a subscription to The Times, you can see this article:

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/columnists/article3635340.ece

They will give you a nasty nip if they get too close

Poor squirrels. They must be extremely dangerous out on the Left Coast.

Had to look this up. Not sure what the following means:-

" Semiautomatic rifles with a magazine capacity greater than five cartridges prohibited (except for western gray squirrel)."

It's ok to use an M240 if you're hunting squirrels?

But in general it looks like the hunting laws are more restrictive here than in Missouri although I am unsure of my interpretation of the following doc:- http://www.dfw.state.or.us/resources/hunting/big_game/regulations/w...

Well I dunno Harold re: Mayan doomsday...Thursday night is usually a bit slow and I note from the Welsh Calendar that the only reasons to celebrate the 20th are:- 1. The last pit in the Rhondda closes 2. Cardiff becomes Capital of Wales 1955...both seem like tame excuses for a party by comparison with the end of the world. Maybe we should have an 'AmeriCymru, The Final Day' knees up on the site?

On a more serious note I suspect that an armed security presence on campus may be the only way to go. Better than arming teachers imho

Ceri, I don't know about Oregon's hunting laws but in Missouri a shotgun is limited to 4 rounds (one in the chamber, 3 in the magazine). A deer rifle is limited to 11 rounds (1 and 10). Any more than that and a hunter can be fined and/or lose his gun. A rifle with a 100 round magazine would not be useful for anything other than hanging on the wall as a decoration (if you're in to that sort of thing) or, as you say, using it for illegal purposes.

I'd like to think that reporter at Columbine was fired from his job or even prosecuted (for idiocy, if nothing else) but I don't suppose that was the case.

I'm very glad I'm not in school in Chicago! In fact I'm very glad I'm not of school age now; what with the violence and the "sexting" I was reading about in the weekend paper. Is there any innocence left these days?

Makes you wonder if she was one of the Mayan doomsday crowd. Her house looked like a palace! Or, as we tend to call them, a McMansion.

Many middle school and secondary public schools (high schools) in America now have armed police on campus. They're euphemistically called SRO's or Student Resource Officers. Personally, I think that's a sign of surrender. It's capitulation to the unruly elements of the student body who should be expelled not policed.

The Mayor of Chicago recently announced a new reform in their public (national) school system: Only one gang per school. Whenever one school has rival gangs enrolled, he explained, it will inevitably lead to conflict. So his solution is to separate those gangs. For example, "Bloods" no longer have to attend the same school as "Crypts"--and vice versa. Though unintentional, I'm sure, it also makes it easier for gang members to extort lunch money, iPods and iPhones from the rest of the student body. Each school becomes an exclusive franchise if you will.

Thanks Ceri for the link to the article on Canadian gun control. It's very informative.

My son-in-law's little sister was a student at Columbine at the time of the shootings. We heard the first news snippets then quickly gathered at our house and sat transfixed in front of the TV that entire afternoon. His little sister was in the very last group to emerge and when it did the cameras zoomed in and we saw her face!

We learned later that CNN had actually put her life in grave danger by announcing the location where she and her fellow students were hiding. A reporter wandering among the assembled, terrified parents overheard part of a mobile phone conversation between one of the students and her Mom saying that they were hiding in a closet in the glee club room. The closet had a metal door and they had barricaded the door with a piano. The reporter immediately announced this juicy tidbit and the shooters overheard it because they had reset all the televisions in the school to CNN or Fox News. One of them immediately went to the music room, attempted to break into the closet, then emptied his gun on the door and the wall. The barricade held.

Today's Daily Telegraph reports that Mrs Lanza is a "prepper" and "survivalist" who has been hoarding supplies and weapons in advance of global meltdown.

Apparently a Republican Congressman very helpfully suggested that the school staff should have been armed for protection.....the mind absolutely boggles.

I'll be able to tell you what The Daily Telegraph says when I read the article properly tomorrow but, apparently, the perpetrator's mother possessed machine guns and an enormous amount of ammunition. I doubt that she was thinking about wildlife when she bought those!

Many thanks for posting both I must say that I agree with Harold that this is not purely a 'hardware' issue.

When I emigrated I brought some traditional UK baggage with me i.e. the view that allowing civilians to possess firearms is crazy and dangerous.

Then I took a look around and realized that there is serious wilderness in the US and I would not like to explore it without some means of self defense against bears and cougars. I also realized that hunting is another valid reason to possess a weapon over here. In Britain all edible wildlife was hunted to extinction centuries ago.

The next stage in the evolution of my thinking on this topic came when I saw Michael Moore's 'Bowling For Columbine'. At some point during the movie ( and I dont remember the precise quote ) he makes the point that Canada has one of the highest rates of gun ownership in the world and nothing like the same incidence of mass killings. Clearly there is a crucial social difference between Canada and the US and maybe Morgan Freeman has hit the nail on the head in the post quoted above.

There is a fascinating and detailed ( if lengthy ) article on the subject of Canadian gun control here:- http://www.guncite.com/journals/dkcgc.html

I wondered though what people thought about the proposed resurrection of the assault weapons ban? If we consider guns as tools then clearly hand guns and hunting rifles serve a certain purpose. They are for hunting and for self defense. BUT it seems to me that assault rifles serve one purpose and one purpose only i.e. killing the largest number of people possible in the shortest possible time. Since mass murder is illegal should we allow people to possess the tools for the job?

Thanks Gaynor. Morgan Freeman is the best!

Ceri, I didn't mean to skirt your question.

The numbers you cite from the Google+ article are ignoring the murder rate. The United States is a nation of 300 million citizens. Any statistic you cite will reflect larger numbers because of our larger population.

According to the United Nations our murder rate is about 1/2 that of Russia--a country of similar size and diversity but with strict gun control. That said, our murder rate exceeds most of Western Europe by 2 to 3 times or about 4.2 persons per 100,000 residents. Compare that to Bermuda which has a murder rate of 12.2 (with laws similar to the UK) or Mexico 16.9 which is four times our murder rate. African nations lead the way but the Honduras has the largest murder rate of 91.6 per 100,000.

That said, most countries throughout the world experience greater murder rates in urban areas. Most of rural America has a murder rate about the same as Western Europe meaning that if you live in Detroit, Washington D.C., New Orleans or Chicago (for instance) the murder rate is higher than the national average.

Thanks for that. Morgan Freeman's very articulate and he's right, of course.

Breaking one prong off a fork does not make it any less dangerous if wielded as a weapon.

An incident in 1927 in Bath, Michigan still remains the largest massacre of innocent school children in US history. Theperpetrator backthen was a disgruntled Council member who had been outvoted on a design proposal for a new school. He retaliated by secretly visiting the construction site each night and packing explosives inside the walls. This premeditated act of sabotage took two years to finalize. Then, on the day of the massacre, a faulty wire limited thecataclysmto just one wing of the school but still killed 45 and seriously injured another 58. He had planned to kill them all without firing a single shot.

In Bath, Michigan the "why" was documented by the perpetrator himself in notes left behind. It was clearly revenge against fellow Council members.

But there are other prongs on the fork.

Mass media has given rise to the worship ofcelebrities. In fact, our modern gods no longer sip ambrosia beneath the marble pillars of Olympus; but, reside, instead, beneath the swaying palms of Malibu where their every move is chronicled ad infinitum. And there seems to be no downside. Every deed only brings more fame and more fortune.

There are those among us who crave fame at any cost.

One day I was standing outside a state office building across from the Capitol Building here in Jefferson City waiting for a bus. A TV reporter towing a cameraman approached me and asked if I "liked" the new the shuttle service? I said "Yes." He then asked me if he could interview me about the new bus stop. I politely turned him down but as he began to walk away I offhandedly said to him, "Boy, this must be a bad day for news..." He whipped around and answered, "No, it's been a very good day! A train hit a pickup over at Centertown killing three...and earlier this afternoon there was a bank robbery in Columbia!"

I remember thinking at the time, "We must have very different ideas of what constitutes a good and bad day..."

Here's what Morgan Freeman, the actor, wrote yesterday on his Facebook page about "why" this great tragedy in Connecticut happened:

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.

It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Columbine? Disturbed

people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."

Following Morgan's advice I deliberately left out mentioning the perpetrator's name. His name should be removed from every lip. We should go to great lengths to accomplish this like the ancient Egyptians did with despotPharaohs--chiseling out their names from monuments and memories.

Here is who we should remember:

Sandy Hill students:

- Charlotte Bacon, 2/22/06, female

- Daniel Barden, 9/25/05, male

- Rachel Davino, 7/17/83, female.

- Olivia Engel, 7/18/06, female

- Josephine Gay, 12/11/05, female

- Ana M. Marquez-Greene, 04/04/06, female

- Dylan Hockley, 3/8/06, male

- Dawn Hocksprung, 06/28/65, female

- Madeleine F. Hsu, 7/10/06, female

- Catherine V. Hubbard, 6/08/06, female

- Chase Kowalski, 10/31/05, male

- Jesse Lewis, 6/30/06, male

- James Mattioli , 3/22/06, male

- Grace McDonnell, 12/04/05, female

- Anne Marie Murphy, 07/25/60, female

- Emilie Parker, 5/12/06, female

- Jack Pinto, 5/06/06, male

- Noah Pozner, 11/20/06, male

- Caroline Previdi, 9/07/06, female

- Jessica Rekos, 5/10/06, female

- Avielle Richman, 10/17/06, female

- Lauren Russeau, 6/1982, female (full date of birth not specified)

- Mary Sherlach, 2/11/56, female

- Victoria Soto, 11/04/85, female

- Benjamin Wheeler, 9/12/06, male

- Allison N. Wyatt, 7/03/06, female

I hate to be the first person to raise this issue on the site and I am not taking any position on it ( not even sure what my position is ) BUT I saw this statistic in a quote over on the G+ network. What does anyone think?

In one year guns killed: 17 in Finland, 35 inAustralia,39 in England & Wales, 60 in Spain, 194 in Germany, 200 in Canada, and 9,484 in America. Perhaps it's time we learned a thing or two from other countries.