As a group exercise for those of you who are serious about learning Welsh, and want some extra practice, how about translating a less well-known text (less well-known, in any case, than the National Anthem, which is being dissected in another thread)?

Let's translate, sentence by sentence, drawing attention in passing to grammatical features we need to be aware of (mutations, subordinate clauses, relative clauses, other points of syntax, etc.).

If you need help with these grammatical concepts at any point you can just shout - the point of this group is to help you learn Welsh, after all!).

Feel free to suggest any pieces you'd like to work on (ideally work which hasn't been translated into English before, so that our work will have to be our own), but for the time being I suggest starting with a short story by D.J. Williams from the classic collection Hen Wynebau (1934). We've translated the first paragraph of "Y Tri Llwyth" ('The Three Tribes'), so here's adding the second paragraph. We could do something easier if you'd like, as well. Just let me know.

Paragraff 1 Ni ddaw neb yn ddinesydd o un hen ardal wledig oni aned, o leiaf, ei dadcu yno. Gall fyw yn y lle yn ddigon hapus o bosibl; ond rhaid i fywyd cyflawn wrth wraidd yn y tir. Y mae gan bob gwir frodor o'r ardal lu o gyfrinachau na w^yr neb ond ef ei hun -- ac ymwybyddiaeth ddirgelaf ei gymrodorion -- ddim amdanynt; pethau nas dinoethir ond ambell dro gan storm y teimlad megis ar ddydd marwolaeth, neu briodas, neu angladd. Eithr ni chlyw neb so^n amdanynt hyd yn oed yr adeg honno, ond ei galon ei hun. Ac eto, y pethau cyfrin, anghyffwrdd hyn, sydd ar yr un pryd yn eiddo i bawb a heb fod yn eiddo i neb ond iddo ef ei hun, yw sylweddau cadarnaf ei fywyd. Yn gymysg a^ hwy y mae tynfeini drud ei dynged ac ysbrydion o'r anwel yn eu gwylio. Pan gollo afael arnynt y mae mewn perygl o golli ei enaid. Pan sonio amdanynt ar goedd hefyd, fel y gwnaf i yn awr -- y mae'n rhedeg i'r un rhysedd. Duw a roddo i mi ynteu, gynildeb y cybydd ar ei aur!

Cyfieithiad: Nobody becomes a citizen of a single, rural county unless his grandfather, at least, was born there. He may possibly live in the place happily enough, but a full life must be rooted in the earth. Every true native of the region possesses a host of secrets that noone but he alone – and the most secret awareness of his fellows – knows anything about; things that are never exposed, but on occasion by the turbulence of emotion, such as on the day of a death, or a wedding, or a funeral. But, nobody will hear tell of them even at that time, apart from his heart alone. And yet, it is these secret intangible things which, at the same time, belong to everyone without belonging to anyone but him alone. They are the surest realities of his life. Among them, the costly lodestone of his destiny. and the spirits of the invisible watch him. If he fails to seize them, he is in peril of losing his soul. If he speaks of them aloud, As I am doing now, he runs to the same difficulty. May God grant me, then, the frugality of the miser over his gold.

Paragraff 2 Y mae yn yr Hen Ardal o ryw wyth neu naw ugain o drigolion, fawr a mân, dri thylwyth o bobl, sydd mor gwbl nodweddiadol ohonynt eu hunain ac mor annhebyg i'w gilydd mewn corff a meddwl a thuedd ag ydoedd yr Iberiad, y Celt, a'r Sacson traddodiadol. Yn ffodus iawn i'r hanesydd hefyd, y mae eu nodweddion personol a threfn eu hamser yn dyfod i'r ardal yn cyfateb yn drawiadol o agos i'r tair cenedl dynghedlawn a enwyd. Gelwir hwy gennym ni, yr ardalwyr, yn Dylwyth Llywele-- sydd acw na w^yr neb ers pa bryd; Tylwyth y Doleydd-- sydd o un ochr yn hen iawn hefyd; a Thylwyth y Cnwc-- sef disgynyddion pâr ifanc o Sir Aberteifi a ddechreuodd eu byd mewn ffarm yn y cyffiniau o'r enw hwnnw, ryw ychydig cyn canol y ganrif ddiwethaf. Erbyn hyn, y mae'r tylwyth hwn wedi llenwi'r ardal ac yn heddychol feddiannu'r wlad oddi amgylch.

There are some fairly advanced structures in there which I'm suspecting will cause most of you who are learning the language a little bit of trouble. If you want help with anything, just post a query and we'll have a chance to discuss it.

So - sentence by sentence (or clause by clause - or even question by question if you prefer) - bant â ni!